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- Nov 15, 2024
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- 158
reposting and edited from my original post of this write-up as I feel it should be in a more public place:
Very long action (I'd estimate around 5-8 hours), much more manic, not a flavor my rats particularly care for in comparison to the 0PC and MXpc analogues but as disso's go it's alright. Be cautious of the mania as it can certainly cause very serious psychotic episodes in your test subjects without proper breaks and its long action can cause them to end up hitting a much higher plateau than expected leading to typical higher dose difficulties related to the class of chemical (The proof is left as an exercise for the reader.) however at controlled lower doses appropriate to the subject's tolerances can be very motivating and its long action is almost a plus. You'll have to experiment to see what works for your research, what is concluded in mine may vary with your subjects.
It will NOT dissolve in water, PG or VG, recommend ethanol as the solvent. Oral administration is preferred as snuff is quite unpleasant to my poor rats. I haven't seen them that snotty in a long time. Furthermore, seemingly due to insolvency, the body's natural processes to dissolve and absorb this do not work with this route. It will sit in their noses and not become as bioavailable (in this researcher's opinion) as something water soluble or PG soluble. rectal is not recommended as the solvent is unsafe for the liver. I have yet to try but certain mild acids may do a good job dissolving but wouldn't change the recommended administration. I would love to hear if anyone has come up with any other solvents that would be safe for administration to my rats.
That being said my research has concluded that the LD50 is probably extremely high compared to the actionable dose which is good news though I refuse outright to intentionally hurt my babies just to further research, makes it much safer for the rats and your studies to continue. I have tested 120mg+ which I DO NOT RECOMMEND PERIOD but if your rats are overly tolerant as mine are they may have a similar action to a non-tolerant or low-tolerant rat at 30mg. Researchers inexperienced in these classes of chemical should NOT go above 5-15mg in your subjects at first. The dose curve is VERY steep, +-5mg is a very significant difference in action. ALWAYS ALLERGY TEST FIRST BEFORE ANY RESEARCH IS CONDUCTED. I highly recommend volumetrically measuring.
As with all in this class, avoid any interactions with anything raising blood pressure or heartrate as both of these tend to shoot up into hypertension. Not recommended if any subjects have cardiac issues. Best to avoid any unnecessary interactions in general but all the same rules typical of dissos should be followed here (no MAOI no SSRI no Stim no CNS depressants). It shows on a drug test as Phencycl if that matters to you.
Very long action (I'd estimate around 5-8 hours), much more manic, not a flavor my rats particularly care for in comparison to the 0PC and MXpc analogues but as disso's go it's alright. Be cautious of the mania as it can certainly cause very serious psychotic episodes in your test subjects without proper breaks and its long action can cause them to end up hitting a much higher plateau than expected leading to typical higher dose difficulties related to the class of chemical (The proof is left as an exercise for the reader.) however at controlled lower doses appropriate to the subject's tolerances can be very motivating and its long action is almost a plus. You'll have to experiment to see what works for your research, what is concluded in mine may vary with your subjects.
It will NOT dissolve in water, PG or VG, recommend ethanol as the solvent. Oral administration is preferred as snuff is quite unpleasant to my poor rats. I haven't seen them that snotty in a long time. Furthermore, seemingly due to insolvency, the body's natural processes to dissolve and absorb this do not work with this route. It will sit in their noses and not become as bioavailable (in this researcher's opinion) as something water soluble or PG soluble. rectal is not recommended as the solvent is unsafe for the liver. I have yet to try but certain mild acids may do a good job dissolving but wouldn't change the recommended administration. I would love to hear if anyone has come up with any other solvents that would be safe for administration to my rats.
That being said my research has concluded that the LD50 is probably extremely high compared to the actionable dose which is good news though I refuse outright to intentionally hurt my babies just to further research, makes it much safer for the rats and your studies to continue. I have tested 120mg+ which I DO NOT RECOMMEND PERIOD but if your rats are overly tolerant as mine are they may have a similar action to a non-tolerant or low-tolerant rat at 30mg. Researchers inexperienced in these classes of chemical should NOT go above 5-15mg in your subjects at first. The dose curve is VERY steep, +-5mg is a very significant difference in action. ALWAYS ALLERGY TEST FIRST BEFORE ANY RESEARCH IS CONDUCTED. I highly recommend volumetrically measuring.
As with all in this class, avoid any interactions with anything raising blood pressure or heartrate as both of these tend to shoot up into hypertension. Not recommended if any subjects have cardiac issues. Best to avoid any unnecessary interactions in general but all the same rules typical of dissos should be followed here (no MAOI no SSRI no Stim no CNS depressants). It shows on a drug test as Phencycl if that matters to you.
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