Agmatine Sulfate Powder

[aintnouse]

So I am continuing my foray into Nootropics and I found this lil gem.  It seems to potentiate the analgesic affects of Opeeiod pain relievers as well as limiting tolerance.  I just ordered some from a company in Az to try.  If it does what it claims to....and I just spent 2 hours researching, I will keep my tolerance down, potentiate the effects and be able to make my stash last longer!!!  If anyone has any experience with this stuff please chime in.   

I am super stoked that, in my research, I found that it can help reduce tolerance and help diminish wd symptoms.    I will report once I receive and try it!

 

[Dumbass#1]

@aintnouse- how'd you do with this stuff??  Sounds too good to be true but I'm curious. 

 

[aintnouse]

@Pooner2013   Funny story......I ordered it and used it a few times and I am still on the fence about it.   I cant really tell if it worked or not and I still have a bunch left!!!  After I used it a few times, I put it in a drawer and forgot about it.   It seems as if it is used mostly by bodybuilders for better workouts and a variety of other things.   There is a ton of stuff about it on the internet, so read about it and see what you think   I will dig it out and give it another whirl.  I will try it again and let you know!  Thanks for reminding me I still  have it!!!

 

[Dumbass#1]

@Pooner2013   Funny story......I ordered it and used it a few times and I am still on the fence about it.   I cant really tell if it worked or not and I still have a bunch left!!!  After I used it a few times, I put it in a drawer and forgot about it.   It seems as if it is used mostly by bodybuilders for better workouts and a variety of other things.   There is a ton of stuff about it on the internet, so read about it and see what you think   I will dig it out and give it another whirl.  I will try it again and let you know!  Thanks for reminding me I still  have it!!!

Very interesting. I will definitely read up on it some more.  Sounds cool - let me know if you eventually figure out if it works for you or not. It sounds gimicky to me so I think I'm going to look for some actual reviews. Thanks 'lil aint!!!

 

[aintnouse]

@Pooner2013    Yeah, I am still not sure about it.  I did try it again last night and it seemed to potentiate what I took, but I don't know if it is just a psychosomatic reaction because we just talked about it.    There is a lot of science based information that discusses the chemical reaction in the brain that takes place but Lil Aint just cant seem to decipher the multi syllable words that are used.   I knew I should not have gotten so damn stoned before physiology class in High School. Sigh......hindsight is 20/20  

 

[Nitetrain]

Correct me if I'm wrong but nootropics, i.e., smart drugs are  enhanced  neurosynaptic reuptake chemicals like serotonin and norepinephrine...making concentration easier. The user experiences a  rush or flood, lf you will, of acetylcholine and epinephrine,  giving the user a feeling of speeding w/out the jitters. Open any Chem 101 book and cross reference w/ adderral and Ritalin. Nootropics scientific literature is boundless and for my 10 cents it's worth a try. I need all the limitless thinking I can get!

 

[LunaLovegood]

At the suggestion of another DBGer, I decided to try this. I ended up finding it quite useful, and I am sure other people around here could benefit similarly.

Agmatine has three reputed effects I was interested in: as an anxiolytic, as a potentiator for 0pis, c@nn@bis, etc., and thirdly as a 0p WD reducer. After experimenting with it some, I didn’t have much luck with it for my anxiety, nor did I notice a potentiating effect.

Well today I finally tried it for WDs, specifically mild meth@d0n3 WDs. I took a very small dose of the agmatine, 250mg. Sometimes larger doses made me dizzy, and I did NOT want to experience WDs *and* dizziness at the same time haha. 
 

 I am honestly shocked at how well it worked. I took it with 2.5 g of kratom, but not on a totally empty stomach(I’d had some coffee) 2 hours later, don’t even feel the slightest bit sick now. This is remarkable. I feel fine. Usually, 2-3g kratom helps me somewhat for about an hour, but it only decreases the WDs, it doesn’t make them go away completely. I’m on 100mgs md0n3 daily(but slowly tapering down), i.e. my 0pi tolerance is obscene. So it definitively isn’t the kratom alone doing the job(2.5g kratom is to 100mgs md0ne as Mercury is to Saturn). For my WDs to be totally gone for several hours seems like a miracle. I’m a bit angry I didn’t know about this stuff years ago when I was still using street 0pis. 

I will update when I have had the chance to experiment some more with agmatine. Even though I have only used it for WDs once, the result are so promising I had to share(and I’m confident I can rule out placebo, etc. 0p WDs don’t just vanish spontaneously, lol). Thanks @LatsDoodis for telling me about this stuff. 

 

[LatsDoodis]

At the suggestion of another DBGer, I decided to try this. I ended up finding it quite useful, and I am sure other people around here could benefit similarly.

Agmatine has three reputed effects I was interested in: as an anxiolytic, as a potentiator for 0pis, c@nn@bis, etc., and thirdly as a 0p WD reducer. After experimenting with it some, I didn’t have much luck with it for my anxiety, nor did I notice a potentiating effect.

Well today I finally tried it for WDs, specifically mild meth@d0n3 WDs. I took a very small dose of the agmatine, 250mg. Sometimes larger doses made me dizzy, and I did NOT want to experience WDs *and* dizziness at the same time haha. 
 

 I am honestly shocked at how well it worked. I took it with 2.5 g of kratom, but not on a totally empty stomach(I’d had some coffee) 2 hours later, don’t even feel the slightest bit sick now. This is remarkable. I feel fine. Usually, 2-3g kratom helps me somewhat for about an hour, but it only decreases the WDs, it doesn’t make them go away completely. I’m on 100mgs md0n3 daily(but slowly tapering down), i.e. my 0pi tolerance is obscene. So it definitively isn’t the kratom alone doing the job(2.5g kratom is to 100mgs md0ne as Mercury is to Saturn). For my WDs to be totally gone for several hours seems like a miracle. I’m a bit angry I didn’t know about this stuff years ago when I was still using street 0pis. 

I will update when I have had the chance to experiment some more with agmatine. Even though I have only used it for WDs once, the result are so promising I had to share(and I’m confident I can rule out placebo, etc. 0p WDs don’t just vanish spontaneously, lol). Thanks @LatsDoodis for telling me about this stuff. 

I’m so pleased to hear you had some positive effects with Agmatine. I don’t know why it isn’t widely suggested as an easy OTC adjunct for other WD interventions. Just so others may find personal appeal, the withdrawals from opioids are just one of the promising uses for drug cessation. It appears alcohol use lowers agmatine in the brain, and alcoholics withdrawing from ethanol abuse who are supplementing with agmatine have NO wd-induced anxiety and drastic reductions of tremors, shakes, and DT symptoms. I discuss my use of agmatine for amphetamine abuse below. But in order of evidence, opiod WD is most studied and demonstrated, then alcohol, and preliminary experiments into methamphetamine and cocaine have begun with encouraging initial results. 
 

Regarding the psychological and behavioral benefits, there is simply not enough information coming from human studies, and it appears that something to do with dose and duration of use is a clue. One crucial factor is that coadministration of L-argine or citrulline pretty much reverses most positive effects (bodybuilding supplements always combine these for “pump” and it makes me crazy! I’ve taken oxandrolone and virtually every vascular steroid available and the pump of Agmatine before the gym is indistinguishable in appearance). So, taken with other amino acids seems to cripple the NO effects that make this such a unique vasodilator, blood pressure normalizer, and the positive allosteric modulatory effects on nearly every neurotransmitter system we know of, but not how it does this. It limits sodium channeling and has some minor NMDA action which calms an overexcited brain. It does a lot, we don’t know the specifics with any exactitude. So, for the lone depression study (I think it was more of a case report as only 5 subjects) the complete remission from MDD was achieved within two weeks at two grams per day. Studies on anxiety in rats show benefits (conditioned place preference/avoidance, forced swim test, etc.) that looks to be anxiolytic at human equivalent 500mg, but higher doses lose effect or worsen lab rat models of depression and anxiety. 

For me, anything much higher that 500mg brings a dysphoria that lasts into the next day; it is inconsistent, though Agmatine certainly is a part of the proximate causation. I use it for amphetamine WD, and have less crushing mood and thoughts, though all other symptoms remain full force (I have just discovered a new tool for amphetamine tolerance and withdrawal, and I’m excited to post it soon.). However, I take adderall medicinally and just abuse it and other stims recreationally (90 tabs of 20mg IR for the month lasts about 10 days, then it’s WD time). So, when I take agmatine concomitantly with adderall at its higher doses, I do notice it completely eliminates the negative amp effects that kill functionality - no hypersexual obsessiveness, less hyper focused effort on the immediately interesting yet “wrong” thing I need to focus, and less time distortion. It feels like it dampens the effects, but after reflection I realize it dampens the excessive, paradoxical effects of stims at recreational doses. I just use it a couple days before I run out of stims. 

 

[LunaLovegood]

This is great! @LatsDoodis, you are awesome! This kind of information is an incredibly valuable contribution to this community, IMO. It really does make a difference in people’s lives. The hours before the clinic opens usually pass agonizingly slowly when I’m sick, but this time it breezed right by. This is going to be an amazing tool for helping me taper down. 

I would say from this experience the most important effect was that it eliminated the dysphoria/physical discomfort of WD. I probably could’ve fallen back asleep, eaten a meal, anything. At approximately 3.5 hours after the first dose, I started feeling sick again. So I took another 250mg of agmatine, and another 2.5g of kratom. Effects were similar, but this time it didn’t completely eliminate the WD effects, just considerably reduced them. 
 

I think perhaps I will try it again for anxiety and as a potentiator. The first few times I took it, it made me feel a bit dizzy, and made my legs heavy. I haven’t noticed that  problem since the first couple days, but I think it kind of put me off the stuff. So I think it’s worth another shot. My depersonalization and anxiety have been especially bad the last week anyway(that’s how my HPPD is; it cycles around: worse for a week, then slightly better for a week and so on),so it’s an excellent opportunity to test the agmatine again. The first time I tested it, I was having a pretty good week anxiety-wise. 
 

Anyway, thanks again for your information, advice, and suggestions. I am really glad you are part of this community, @LatsDoodis! We are lucky to have you here

 

[LunaLovegood]

@LatsDoodis Although I don’t like uppers of any kind(excepting em-dee-em-may), I’ll be fascinated to hear about the other supplement you said you’d be posting about soon. I myself am planning to try several herbal extracts/resins(kava, kanna, blue lotus, etc.), and intend to post reports of the effects of the herbs themselves, as well as reviews of the suppliers I buy from. 
 

The main vendor threads(US, intl., email, Mex, RCs) with reviews may be the lifeblood of this forum. As much knowledge as I’ve gained from the vendors sections of DBG, I’ve learned just as much from threads like this one. So I figured let’s try and improve these “all about ____” sections by seeking out useful over-the-counter/non-controlled/herbal subst@nc3s and report my findings here. 

 

[LunaLovegood]

Wanted to do a very short update on agmatine, now that I’ve had more experience with it. All I have to add is that I have found the results I got in my initial report have been repeatable. It really does help that much with WDs. As long as I’m on 0pi8s, I will always keep some agmatine in the house. Anyone kicking or cutting back needs to try this stuff.