I am moving to a new address.

porkandbeansboy

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I am planning to Donate soon and I am also in the middle of moving to a new address and have to pay first and last months rent once that's done I am Donating. That's when it hit Me... the idea that it would be the perfect time to Order something when moving to a new Location. Since it would be easier to claim someone else purchased this package and I just only just moved into this house and never ordered this or know who orders this. 


  Where I live they don't even make you sign it and if the package is not left on my front porch they will normally leave a note/sticker to on my Door saying to come claim it from the post office which I will then know something is up since my friend orders things on Amazon in the same Town as Me and they never once left a sticker on his Door and even when I ordered my like 600$ Canadian Volcano Vaporizer on the front porch for anyone to of stolen it. So if that happens or they want Me to either Sign for it with a "Fake Name" since nearly all Vendors use Bitcoin and it's not like you need to give your real name using Bitcoin but I have read that you should put your real name I have no idea as I this would be my first time Ordering anything but Research Chemicals. 


  FYI Summer Vacation starts like June 6 Or June something from what I remember probably far later in June but I do know Canadian school starts on September 6th and that like Summer for the U.S. starts in April and ends in like august or something I'm not sure as I learned this throuigh communicating with a friend a long time ago. 

 
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I don't know of any vendor here that has you sign for deliveries, but once in a great while the driver won't be paying attention and thinks you need to sign (it's happened to me and I went ahead and signed), but normally you should never have to sign. It's easier to deny knowing anything if you can say "they just left this I don't even know what it is".

I almost always leave the package sitting there once I bring it in and don't open it right away. Not that I am expecting anyone to knock on my door, but every little precaution that is easy to do seems like the smart way to go. Even if it is only because it gives you more peace of mind. 

 
@2earls I thought I was the only one that did that! 😂🤣  

On a seriouser note: What I have learned is that by signing anything from the shipping companies one is only confirming the letter has been left in your hands. Not that you are making a statement of fact about who, what, when, where and why. At least in the US. Please anyone can correct me if I am wrong. I have been told this by my fav attorney,  who I am rather partial to, in full disclosure! 

Shoot, I order so much from Amazon that anytime someone puts the tablet in my hands to sign, I just do it automatically.  Chances are its that watermelon cutter or the next-best-thing-since-sliced-bread lightening deal. I will sort it out in a couple-three days. 

 
Same here @alixjones2018. Between Amazon and Ebay I almost feel like my shopping  (and the husband's) has a purpose other than making my closets bulge. It is a distraction so that the deliveries from here are just another one of many.

I'm sure you are probably right about signing not being an admission of knowledge about the package. I have signed for my neighbor unknowingly so if we were held responsible it could be quite a mess.

Still, nobody likes to sign if they don't have to whether it's rational or not.

 
In some states you can setup where the postal carrier will sign for it in your a absence, thus still leaving your delivery.....you can also intentionally miss the delivery and be left the pink slip, in which you sign and leave for the postman to see the next day.

You are correct @alixjones2018 anyone at the address over X age can sign for it. That does not make them responsible for contents. A package with your name sitting on your porch unopened is still not guilty of anything. Also, I've never once had a postman check my ID, I just sign JohnDoe in kindergarten style. Postman doesn't give a shit what's in your box, he just wants them all to be off that truck as fast as possible.

One thing that I caught last week where I almost tripped up: Private mailboxes. Even the mom and pop ones. When you fill out the USPS form (form#1153? I think?) you are giving them permission to receive your mail. Cool, fine, whatever. Then it hit me that also gives them authority to open any mail or packages. I basically got the feel in person last week that every single package mom and pops stores around here receive - it will be opened if they forward it to you. They want to open and repackage in order to make money besides only a shipping label taped over the old one.

 
Wow was not expecting such fast replies with very helpful answers thank you everyone here at DBG and I am extremely thankful to everyone that replied in this thread. I got just one more question since I am purchasing with Bitcoin I don't even need to use my real name so my question is would it be better to use a fake name or real name or from what you all have told Me it does not matter if it's my real name or a fake name correct Me if I am wrong about that.  


  

 
 B U y Et1z0l@m . c0m apparently has you sign for your Orders.

 
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Porkandbeanr I have ordered from them south east Canada several time never had to sign.

 
So I’m fairly knowledgeable about US controlled substances and fed analogue act; and even wrote my law school “thesis” on analogs and the law. I can tell you as far as US law enforcement is concerned, you are guilty of possessing and possibly using USPS for mail fraud; both carry heavy penalties. There’s a famous criminal procedure case that mirrors the “I had no knowledge of what’s in the package I signed for” involving a girl who agreed to take an extra luggage bag back to the US and really wasn’t aware - although of course a reasonable person would try to make some effort to verify legality in this case, she may have simply been naive or “don’t ask, don’t tell” policy. If I’m recalling correctly, the fact that she accepted a bag full of controlled substances was enough to meet the element of her crimes, and she was harshly deemed willing and with reason to double check who and what might be “accepted.” Every US and the fair bit of Canada enforcement operations will have an undercover cop posing as your mailman and a team is ready to bust in and search your house once you’ve signed for a package. Rule number one is: if it’s your normal mail person you’re fine. They aren’t put in dangerous operations like this ever.

Rule two is to go with the most overburdened shipping carrier - usps and national parcel services (though the crimes are higher) because they’re not very good at detecting illicit parcels or packages dealing with food, animal and veterinary health, drugs pharmaceutical or otc, and care a great deal about catching mislabeled shipments of a benign chemical that will in fact end up as part of an “active drug ingredient” despite labeling for some cheaper purpose. Of note when dealint with a carrier is the private companies and their agreements to assist customs or otherwise deliver under contract for the state postal service- they care less about catching offenders and more about publicity; and those with primary concern for expediency (and less international cooperation between custom agencies) are best. DHL doesn’t officially onboard a customs inspector to inspect suspicious packages during flight time from Europe to N. America, but for Canada I don’t know - I think Purolator does, but even so this is never going to be an issue for small personal orders. The imaging and protocols in force for bothe US and Canada are virtually identical, with both agencies having bound themselves to agreements on rules and procedures for customs inspections to occur validly, yet take zero to a minimum few days to “clear.”

If you do get a notice of seizure from customs, completely ignore it and move on with your life. I estimate 95% of the mailing drugs arrests involve a postal worker on the inside who is discovered by supervision of their work routine. That is taken seriously. These drug enforcement agencies are more concerned with national repositories and lab analysis of seized substances to determine smart operation logistics at the border and other trends in “data” here. Unless you’re part of a distribution chain and happen to be seeking uncommonly high volumes of drugs - especially opioids at this point - no local and federal interagency drug bust is in the budget.

So, rule two is to sign if nothing tips you off, or take the note to the post office yourself in a day or two. And yes, you’re right about local mailboxes and shipping locations festering with employees who take advantage of illicit packages. I have a friend who would get close to a pound of weed every week just working as a clerk at a small town UPS. But nobody is officially going to open and inspect after clearance from customs. Delivery carriers are gonna try to stay safe, but they just want to get you your mail asap. In the US we have USPS Informed Delivery on the tracking website, and this gives me the option to electronically sign days or so before taking possession, but if I do sign at the door I usually just say “wasn’t expecting anything, hope it’s actually for me,” and sign my real name “for intended deliveree or custodian.” These days I am simply not young and paranoid anymore, so I actually scribble something and hurry inside to check out my goodies. So the last rule is to sign ahead of time online, if possible, and to check for your usual mail person. If it’s too fishy for you let them leave a tag and go pick it up in a couple days - multiple full day officers waiting at your local post office is a waste of time and money for these guys. So make your order, sign if you must - and definitely use your real name as the fraud and deceit crimes just get added - you’re just a small time, average young male stereotype of online drug shipping. They won’t have the resources to go after you even if they wanted to do so. I received a customs seizure letter for 500 indian mags and it got lost in tracking, but FIVE years later somehow US customs finally let me know...

Finally, the last point is more of a clarification on what these newsworthy law enforcement operations are really about: making large scale arrests and charging everyone all the crimes on the books so the public and dealers may hesitate. If you follow up, most of the people are let free for lack of evidence, or given simple and small plea deals, even if there is large quantities here.  Barely anyone gets caught this way, and Canada recently did it once and proudly lists the news of arrests for etizolam and large amounts of heroin a couple ordered for delivery. This was even before etizolam was put on Canada’s ridiculous lists of controlled substances and “their derivatives, isomers, salts, etc.” There are several state and one circuit case where someone fought charges for RCs under these analog provisions and won. Several didn’t, but probably had shitty expert witnesses. It’s absolutely not constitutional to ban some unidentifiable act and criminalize those who aren’t fortunate enough to estimate just how “substantially similar in effect and chemical composition” the analog must be. This is what routinely results in a suit for declaration by large companies doing something that is a “cruel, two horned“ dilemma - carry out business and profit to the best of their capacity yet risk breaking a vague law, or be cautionary, cease that aspect of business and lose out but live to operate another day. Most decisions - though there are few - with respect to RCs rule the first prong irrelevant or unconstitutionally vague because “similar effects” means if it gets you high, essentially. Similar chemical structure is arguable but unwise. Most defendants point to the patent or licensing of trade property in pharma - escitalopram and citalopram are like D and L amphetam!ne, yet sold separate and patented separate and distinct. Many RCs were patented or under licensed exclusive deals for drug development years ago and simply never made it to market. 
 

Sorry for the long rambling post. I wanted to help as I’ve been there with those concerns as well, but I am also really passionate about drug control and police powers to criminalize harmful substances - with RCs it’s before they’ve hit the market in many cases. How can adequate harm and risk assessment be undertaken? Plus, I am on a new phone and the typing is weird  and it’s been a long month for me. Hope you found some reassurance from the community here, and hope you simply skipped any tangential points I drifted towards. Best of luck and be well!

 
I was told by a V3nd0r on here that they until COVID-19 had always required the packages to be signed for. I never had to sign once for any of them.

I don't live alone and the other person living with me doesn't know about the packages and the contents of what I order. From what I read it's the signing that is how they get you. I'm hoping it might be possible to not have to sign for the package as I'm not sure if it's just a requirement for the shipping method.

 
It was always my understanding to never sign for a package but I can be wrong on that.. I personally would never sign for one unless the vendor gave me a heads up or something

 
@porkandbeansboy I’ve def signed for packages from EU vendors who will only send in a way you have to sign for.  I understand why they do this, to prevent people scamming them saying they never received, but it’s always a bit nerve-wracking.  In the states they will leave a little slip in your mailbox and you can just sign the slip and leave it in the mailbox and they will leave the package the following day.  At least that’s what they do in my area.  If anyone came to my door it would be more than obvious it’s a controlled delivery cuz they never come to my door and i know both of the postal workers in my area! (i live VERY rural!).  They will not do a controlled delivery via signed slip of paper because it’s not controlled.  The package has to be seen in your possession.  I have signed once for a pack at the post office years ago in a different place and it was heaps scary but turned out fine.  I know at least one person busted that way.  He thought (wrongly) that they wouldn’t do a CD at the post office cuz they couldn’t know when he was coming in.  Apparently cops have no problem waiting.  That was for a very high quantity pack not for personal use of course.

Anyways, your pack has a MUCH higher chance of being confiscated at customs than at your post office, especially if it’s not something that smells, like weed or whatever.  So if it’s small then you’ll only get an LL.  At least that’s my experience in the US.  

 
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