Starting To Worry

[Guest]

Yeah you have to be very careful... benzo w/d symptoms are in a class of their own. Withdrawal from anything can be serious, but I've never felt the madness of suddenly stopping klons after taking them for a long period of time. I don't know if I'm a wuss, but the ZAPS scare me to sh*t! Not a good feeling!

 

[The Shattered Soldier]

Since I seem to have been shafted by a certain vendor, I had to go out and obtain a script for diazepam. Phenobarbital wouldn't cut it. I'm starting to work myself off the benzos, but, yes, I will be needing more diazepam as that method takes a LONG time. Benzo withdrawal is dangerous though, so I and anyone else going through it must be very careful.

Benzos can be your best friend and your most fearful enemy all contained in pill form...

I know this topic is a little old but I figured I would post. If you're tapering off of Benzos, Diazepam is definitely the way to go. However, in my experience, the taper, no matter how slow, is a scary and sometimes emotionally painful process. I tried to do it over the course of three months but every step down just made things harder and harder. I still had an anxiety problem, but now I was getting less medications for it. I know what suddenly stopping feels like and the gut wrenching, "I'm losing my fucking mind" feeling, and this wasn't it, this was anxiety. My anxiety. It just wasn't being treated with the right dose any longer. When I couldn't take it anymore the online orders started coming in again, then they would run out, and it got to the point where I just wanted to die. I was completely trapped by this, I had lost my willpower, the drugs would call me and I would come. Since they make you lose your inhibition, I would usually get to the point where I just couldn't stop until they were gone. Now there is supposedly a time period around three days, according to a former doctor of mine, where you're seizure prone. When I went in to tell him I was having problems, he told me that he would no longer prescribe me the medications. So I asked, "what about the seizure risk?" He said, "you would have had one by now, we don't have to worry about that at this point."

So I went into rehab, and they weaned me off of them with librium in 3 days. I was fine while I was there, but when I got home, the anxiety reached a new level. I was going to these obnoxious NA meetings and group therapy. I was sober for 6 months and not really doing any better when I went on a binge. I told my new doctor and got a Valium prescription. I used an online pharmacy to triple the dose and taper down from there. I got to the point where I only need the prescription and stuck with it. Things got worse and my doc doubled it. But the anxiety was intermittent, and the meds kind of just took some of the edge off of it. Now, I sometimes forget they even exist. I'll usually only pop a few if I've had too much coffee. I don't abuse them any longer because my tolerance is very high (it takes about 150mg of Valium to reach my threshold), and to tell you the truth, the effects kind of make me sick now. The strangest thing is that now that I've been buying this ADHD med, I have almost no use for them at all.

That's wonderful, I know. It's like that stupid little "footprints" story. Well, me and my new med were talking about it and I asked him about why there are only one set of footprints now. He laughed and said, "because I'm riding on your back."

 

[386dc]

go to a walk in clinic and explain your problem, explain u will have a seizure if u quit taking the drugs

they will prob give u a script to get u thru a few days and refer to a GP or drug abuse psychiatrist.

spend the money and go see a doctor to taper u off properly.

 

[The Shattered Soldier]

go to a walk in clinic and explain your problem, explain u will have a seizure if u quit taking the drugs

they will prob give u a script to get u thru a few days and refer to a GP or drug abuse psychiatrist.

spend the money and go see a doctor to taper u off properly.

You sound pretty insightful. Have you tapered off of benzo's too? It's a living hell isn't it? I'm so glad my body doesn't think I need those mother fuckers anymore. It's such a mind fuck isn't it? I mean, you used up all of your willpower to get through the mental anguish of the taper, and you wonder where it went when you find yourself deciphering Palmira's codes, looking at that worthless little yellow 5mg pill the doc prescribed you and just bust out singing, "are you ready for some football?"

 

[Khalifa]

go to a walk in clinic and explain your problem, explain u will have a seizure if u quit taking the drugs


they will prob give u a script to get u thru a few days and refer to a GP or drug abuse psychiatrist.


spend the money and go see a doctor to taper u off properly.

For me that cant happen. I wish. Little money now and I was treated to badly to even want to return to a walk in again. Should be the correct advice though indeed.
Starting to worry that’s all. Just as the thread is titled.

 

[Jewbacca]

I realize this isn't much help, but I know an excellent, compassionate, older family doc in Indiana that is very understanding of patients with anxiety, and who is a firm believer in benzo therapy. He takes new patients on a referral basis, and is quite inexpensive and low-hassle. If anyone is within driving distance of the midwest and would like additional information, just let me know.

 

[The Shattered Soldier]

For me that cant happen. I wish. Little money now and I was treated to badly to even want to return to a walk in again. Should be the correct advice though indeed.

Starting to worry that’s all. Just as the thread is titled.

For some people it takes a long time, for others it doesn't have to be so long. I mean, after 3 days of Librium in rehab I did a rapid taper and did well for a while. I had been doing some other dangerous shit and that damage hit me later causing anxiety. I was in and out of withdrawal just about every month for four years before the doctor taper, then rehab admission. So I stopped writing and read up on seizures. I think it's interesting that people who are on long acting benzos often have seizures three weeks after their last dose. Kind of scary. I just want to offer my support because I know how hard it is and there really is no way to simplify how your detox will commence or progress. Even though I'm "never supposed to take them again" I still have anxiety, and still take 10-20mg of diazepam when I feel the need. Then again, a lot has changed sinced my addictive state. Finding the right combo of meds for my psychiatric diagnosis was a huge part of it. This is what I mean when I say that you could be way passed withdrawal and still feel horribly anxious. The underlying problem is still there. It could be brain receptor sensitivity, an abundance of dopamine being converted to neurepinephrine, or, if you're lucky, a physiological disorder within the body. It doesn't always have to do with GABA, the neurotransmittor that bezos play with.

Antipsychotics block various receptors that contribute to anxiety, mostly serotonin and dopamine receptors. Of the newer and safer medications, Seroquel establishes the most complete blockade of the brain's stimulatory receptors. For example, I do a lot of stims, which stimulate dopmine receptors. They can cause you to feel anxious, jittery, paranoid, etc. You could take a benzo to ease that. If I take 200mg of Seroquel it shuts it down like I never took anything, I'll stumble around the house for a while eating everything I can find, until my eyes wown't focus and it's time to find my bed fast. The more stims I do, the harder it hits. The stuff makes you moody and depressed though, because it blocks the 5ht-2a serotonin receptors as well.

So you have this very unique and interesting medication called Abilify. Another powerful antipsychotic medication that I am apalled at it's frequent appearance in television commercials. We don't know how much this stuff can do yet, I would love to be one to study it. So it blocks dopamine receptors, not to the extent that Seroquel does, but I've seen it calm moderately psychotic individuals. What I recently discovered is that it blocks dopamine receptors than enable the euphoric effect of cocaine and ritalin. So expect it to be used for drug dependency in the future. Unlike Seroquel, it does not block the 5ht-2a receptors, instead it sensitizes them. So when serotonin hits these receptors, the effect is amplified. That's why they use it with antidepressants. So you get a calming effect and a stimulatory effect all at once. Its a miracle for some people.

Since GABA receptors are widely distributed throughtout the central nervous system, and have the ability to inhibit any stimulatoy action of every neurotranmittor, I think many who end up self medicating with benzos are seeking relief from an unrelated imbalance. The biggest problem is that benzo's do have this brain wide inhibition capability and when they are gone, there is the potential for brain wide over-stimulation, as well as the over-stimulation of other parts of the body where GABA plays a role in relaxation. This makes full withdrawal an extraordinarily distressful and painful experience, it has the ability to grip every piece of you, grate against your will, and alter your perception of reality.

On the bright side, anything that happens to you in life doesn't seem so bad after that if you choose to use it as a comparison. I just hope you can find a way around this, Vitalis, and that some of the information I gave you helped, whether or not you gave a shit about the technical aspects or not, this shit isn't simple, and I refuse to let anyone simplify it.

 

[Jewbacca]

For some people it takes a long time, for others it doesn't have to be so long. I mean, after 3 days of Librium in rehab I did a rapid taper and did well for a while. I had been doing some other dangerous shit and that damage hit me later causing anxiety. I was in and out of withdrawal just about every month for four years before the doctor taper, then rehab admission. So I stopped writing and read up on seizures. I think it's interesting that people who are on long acting benzos often have seizures three weeks after their last dose. Kind of scary. I just want to offer my support because I know how hard it is and there really is no way to simplify how your detox will commence or progress. Even though I'm "never supposed to take them again" I still have anxiety, and still take 10-20mg of diazepam when I feel the need. Then again, a lot has changed sinced my addictive state. Finding the right combo of meds for my psychiatric diagnosis was a huge part of it. This is what I mean when I say that you could be way passed withdrawal and still feel horribly anxious. The underlying problem is still there. It could be brain receptor sensitivity, an abundance of dopamine being converted to neurepinephrine, or, if you're lucky, a physiological disorder within the body. It doesn't always have to do with GABA, the neurotransmittor that bezos play with.

Antipsychotics block various receptors that contribute to anxiety, mostly serotonin and dopamine receptors. Of the newer and safer medications, Seroquel establishes the most complete blockade of the brain's stimulatory receptors. For example, I do a lot of stims, which stimulate dopmine receptors. They can cause you to feel anxious, jittery, paranoid, etc. You could take a benzo to ease that. If I take 200mg of Seroquel it shuts it down like I never took anything, I'll stumble around the house for a while eating everything I can find, until my eyes wown't focus and it's time to find my bed fast. The more stims I do, the harder it hits. The stuff makes you moody and depressed though, because it blocks the 5ht-2a serotonin receptors as well.

So you have this very unique and interesting medication called Abilify. Another powerful antipsychotic medication that I am apalled at it's frequent appearance in television commercials. We don't know how much this stuff can do yet, I would love to be one to study it. So it blocks dopamine receptors, not to the extent that Seroquel does, but I've seen it calm moderately psychotic individuals. What I recently discovered is that it blocks dopamine receptors than enable the euphoric effect of cocaine and ritalin. So expect it to be used for drug dependency in the future. Unlike Seroquel, it does not block the 5ht-2a receptors, instead it sensitizes them. So when serotonin hits these receptors, the effect is amplified. That's why they use it with antidepressants. So you get a calming effect and a stimulatory effect all at once. Its a miracle for some people.

Since GABA receptors are widely distributed throughtout the central nervous system, and have the ability to inhibit any stimulatoy action of every neurotranmittor, I think many who end up self medicating with benzos are seeking relief from an unrelated imbalance. The biggest problem is that benzo's do have this brain wide inhibition capability and when they are gone, there is the potential for brain wide over-stimulation, as well as the over-stimulation of other parts of the body where GABA plays a role in relaxation. This makes full withdrawal an extraordinarily distressful and painful experience, it has the ability to grip every piece of you, grate against your will, and alter your perception of reality.

On the bright side, anything that happens to you in life doesn't seem so bad after that if you choose to use it as a comparison. I just hope you can find a way around this, Vitalis, and that some of the information I gave you helped, whether or not you gave a shit about the technical aspects or not, this shit isn't simple, and I refuse to let anyone simplify it.

Now THAT'S a post with some meat on the bone! Nice detail...

 

[Khalifa]

Thank you for that honest posting. I sure hope people will read and study it. Take what they need and use it to at least understand the process of recovering from addiction. Damn right, no easy answer.

~Wiz

 

[Guest]

go to a walk in clinic and explain your problem, explain u will have a seizure if u quit taking the drugs

they will prob give u a script to get u thru a few days and refer to a GP or drug abuse psychiatrist.

spend the money and go see a doctor to taper u off properly.

Do you honestly believe this? You'll instantly be labeled as being guilty of drug-seeking behavior and they'll show you the door.

In other news, since I think I started this thread, I can report on the fact that I've given up my fight against benzos; their hold on me is too powerful.

And it's one, two, three, what are we fighting for? Don't ask me, I don't give a damn: Next stop is alprazolam!

PS= I need Jewbacca to divulge the location of this MILF Island he lives on, show some compassion and let me die happy!!

:lol:

 

[Jewbacca]

Do you honestly believe this? You'll instantly be labeled as being guilty of drug-seeking behavior and they'll show you the door.

In other news, since I think I started this thread, I can report on the fact that I've given up my fight against benzos; their hold on me is too powerful.

And it's one, two, three, what are we fighting for? Don't ask me, I don't give a damn: Next stop is alprazolam!

PS= I need Jewbacca to divulge the location of this MILF Island he lives on, show some compassion and let me die happy!!

/default_laugh.png

Not to make light of the situation at all, but I love the song adaptation Vitalis! "Next stop is alprazolam!", that's some solid lyrical work right there! And for what it's worth, I'm with you on the "just go to a walk in clinic" philosophy. While I'm sure 386 is well intentioned, the odds of happening onto a clinic that would be that compassionate, progressive and understanding is very, very slim. My almost 67 year old mother is the director of nursing at a dual diagnosis drug and alcohol facility here in town, affiliated with our big, inner city hospital, and I can just see the judgmental death glare as I type this. In fairness, I've know a few rehab docs over time that were very easy to work with, and were rooted in reality, but they are VERY few and far between.

Oh, and MIlf Island is just a little south of Benzo Bay. Unfortuantely, the ferry from over there is a little unreliable, and despite their schedule, seem to always run days late in arriving. Go figure!

Take it easy...

Jewy

 

[The Shattered Soldier]

Do you honestly believe this? You'll instantly be labeled as being guilty of drug-seeking behavior and they'll show you the door.

In other news, since I think I started this thread, I can report on the fact that I've given up my fight against benzos; their hold on me is too powerful.

And it's one, two, three, what are we fighting for? Don't ask me, I don't give a damn: Next stop is alprazolam!

PS= I need Jewbacca to divulge the location of this MILF Island he lives on, show some compassion and let me die happy!!

/default_laugh.png

Yup, that's set my dual diagnosis essay into motion. i can hear them talking in the clinic or ER right now.

"Hey Bill, we got another one, says he's going to have a seizure if he don't get his fix."

"Does he want that seven day prescription too? Ha Ha."

"Of course, that's the seizure threat ransom, but seriously, tell him that he came to a good place to have a seizure, but next time go try that line in a china shop."

"Yeah, a JFK collector's plate can get you about 30 V's"

"Well, get him in out of here just is case he does seize and I have to do all of that paperwork.

Vitalis, I don't blame you for keeping your run going. If it's not causing major life problems or behavioral changes, and its available, trying to quit at this point will only result in failure. People successfully quit drugs when they hit rock bottom, when things get so bad that they have no other choice. I really think without that type of motivation, something real, not anticipated, people will find it very hard to make a firm commitment to quit. Something more important than the drug has to be at stake.

 

[Guest]

Exactly, I'm just being masochistic by forcing my disease-riddled body to go without its proper dose of benzos. I'm going to try to stop drinking in combination with the benzos and try to keep myself occupied as much as possible so the crazy thoughts can't get as firm a grasp; that's all I can do. I'm far too insane, isolated and delirious to know when I've hit rock bottom; I always assume things could be worse and I'm always correct in that assumption.

One day I'll just jump into Benzo Bay and swim to MILF Island, it sounds too wonderful to pass up. The final swing is not a drill; it's how many liver cells I can kill.

Okay, the crazy thoughts are lurking around my perimeter but I'll squash those little buggers!

h34r:

 

[The Shattered Soldier]

Exactly, I'm just being masochistic by forcing my disease-riddled body to go without its proper dose of benzos. I'm going to try to stop drinking in combination with the benzos and try to keep myself occupied as much as possible so the crazy thoughts can't get as firm a grasp; that's all I can do. I'm far too insane, isolated and delirious to know when I've hit rock bottom; I always assume things could be worse and I'm always correct in that assumption.

One day I'll just jump into Benzo Bay and swim to MILF Island, it sounds too wonderful to pass up. The final swing is not a drill; it's how many liver cells I can kill.

Okay, the crazy thoughts are lurking around my perimeter but I'll squash those little buggers!

/default_ph34r.png

Some people never reach rock bottom, they can cope with anything that comes there way. Then there are people who need the extreme rock bottom's. Here is an example of an extreme rock bottom:

"Mmmmmm, how are my dear, sweet, beloved Hot Pockets this morning? Are you ready for my gentle and loving mastication? I love you, promise you'll always be there for me. My life is nothing without you. Let's get you all...hey! What's wrong with this microwave again? I Just bought it last week! Oh god, look what I did last night, another baby in the microwave, FUCK! How the hell do babies break microwaves? Are they made of aluminum fucking foil? And where in the hell am I getting all of these babies from? That's it! I can't take another week like this, not again, it'll kill me. I....just...can't...live like THIS! It's either the dust or the Hot Pockets. No matter how many times I tell myself, 'babies break microwaves, no Hot Pockets for a week' it doesn't work. Goodbye old friend, I've finally had it, you've hurt me for the very last time. I quit.

 

[Guest]

Some people never reach rock bottom, they can cope with anything that comes there way. Then there are people who need the extreme rock bottom's. Here is an example of an extreme rock bottom:

"Mmmmmm, how are my dear, sweet, beloved Hot Pockets this morning? Are you ready for my gentle and loving mastication? I love you, promise you'll always be there for me. My life is nothing without you. Let's get you all...hey! What's wrong with this microwave again? I Just bought it last week! Oh god, look what I did last night, another baby in the microwave, FUCK! How the hell do babies break microwaves? Are they made of aluminum fucking foil? And where in the hell am I getting all of these babies from? That's it! I can't take another week like this, not again, it'll kill me. I....just...can't...live like THIS! It's either the dust or the Hot Pockets. No matter how many times I tell myself, 'babies break microwaves, no Hot Pockets for a week' it doesn't work. Goodbye old friend, I've finally had it, you've hurt me for the very last time. I quit.

That was me 10 years ago, I don't think rock bottom truly exists. It's an abstract concept concocted by the rehab-industrial complex intended to make you think you need help when in reality all you need are more benzos.

And microwaves, we need more damn microwaves due to the overabundance of babies.

I suggest you just keep on the dust and Hot Pockets and I'll rely on my benzo crutch. All's well that ends well and so on...

 

[doesit]

I think the having a seizure or dying card trick is a bit overrated,id consider myself a light user,over a year now,and whenever i stop i do go into withdrawal mode but it takes at least 3 days to kick in,that's when irritation and anxiety start to come back.Also i dont go cold turkey if i know ill be in difficult,or anxious positions that day or some other day i take meds as usual.Other then that theres more people dying from vitamin C or allergies to peanuts everyday then someone ODing from benzo withdrawal compared one day to one year benzo,its more like a myth that goes around,because if you were prone to anxiety before or panic attacks theres 100% chance that you are likely to get one,from going cold turkey as your body got used to feel relaxed in most problematic situations,and once meds are gone its overreacting and you dont know how to cope execpt going into panic or seizure mode,similar to those people that i have seen on tv where they take drugs on beach parties,and someone who hasnt tried before goes into panic mode that they are dying.To avoid that one has to take into account that once you start benzos its moderation and the way you use that that they will work for you or against you.If someone is prone to popping pills,using drugs,alcohol without moderation and second thought,in such case think that your going only down with every pill you take.

 

[386dc]

it happened with a friend of mine granted it was 10yrs ago and in south FL things are bit more wild west with pills and docs

than most places in the country,but yeah he was coming off xanax and started having seizures went to a doc and they fixed him

up got him tapered offe eventually he went back to using again,hey dont shoot the mssenger

 

[Guest]

it happened with a friend of mine granted it was 10yrs ago and in south FL things are bit more wild west with pills and docs

than most places in the country,but yeah he was coming off xanax and started having seizures went to a doc and they fixed him

up got him tapered offe eventually he went back to using again,hey dont shoot the mssenger

Well, if he was already having seizures and not just saying that he was going to have a seizure then yeah, they'd have to do something for him. What I was saying is that just walking into a clinic and claiming you're a benzo addict and about to have seizures will get you nowhere 99.999999% of the time.

I went to an outpatient rehab place in SE FL when I used to live there in Jan 2005 with a benzo/alcohol problem. I saw a doctor there, got a script for Librium and Lexapro (I threw the Lexapro script away) and I visited with a LCSW who was on staff there a few times. Eventually I got fed up with the LCSW because she kept telling me to go to AA meetings, so I just followed the taper schedule the doctor had given me to use with the Librium.

The area I live in now is rural so we don't have those types of ritzy outpatient rehab places, believe me, it was EXPENSIVE and it certainly wasn't a walk-in clinic or ER. No way would a walk-in clinic or ER hook you up with benzos just because you're complaining at them, I should know, I've been to the ER three times due to extreme panic attacks and they couldn't have cared less. Now I just try to make sure I have meds to deal with any attack I may have or I suffer through them, because clinics and ERs are the last places I want to go.

 

[The Shattered Soldier]

Well, if he was already having seizures and not just saying that he was going to have a seizure then yeah, they'd have to do something for him. What I was saying is that just walking into a clinic and claiming you're a benzo addict and about to have seizures will get you nowhere 99.999999% of the time.

I went to an outpatient rehab place in SE FL when I used to live there in Jan 2005 with a benzo/alcohol problem. I saw a doctor there, got a script for Librium and Lexapro (I threw the Lexapro script away) and I visited with a LCSW who was on staff there a few times. Eventually I got fed up with the LCSW because she kept telling me to go to AA meetings, so I just followed the taper schedule the doctor had given me to use with the Librium.

The area I live in now is rural so we don't have those types of ritzy outpatient rehab places, believe me, it was EXPENSIVE and it certainly wasn't a walk-in clinic or ER. No way would a walk-in clinic or ER hook you up with benzos just because you're complaining at them, I should know, I've been to the ER three times due to extreme panic attacks and they couldn't have cared less. Now I just try to make sure I have meds to deal with any attack I may have or I suffer through them, because clinics and ERs are the last places I want to go.

Good job throwing away the Lexapro, it's very common to be anxious on those SSRI's for the first few weeks. My insurance company sent me to one of those moderately "ritzy" rehab facilities. It was fun, lot's of drug people to talk to. They let me bring my acoustic guitar and had a nice little fan base. Sing along time was after dinner, I'd find a tune that everyone knew and we'd have a blast. They had a beautiful meditation room, a reflection garden, REALLY good food, but a lot of anti-drug propaganda, mandatory NA/AA meetings, etc. But every staff member, including the main director were addicts. There was only one who never used, and ended up being my small group counselor and she really sucked.

I did 90 days in NA after, listening to self righteous fucks and people with sunshine coming out their asses, "I'm off of drugs! My life is so meaningful and happy now. I'm free!" Well, I was anxious and depressed. The strangest thing about it was that I would have former heroin addicts come up to me and say, "You kicked BENZO'S, shit, I couldn't imagine going through that! Must have been hell." This would happen often.

As for the seizures, we all have a different threshold, I think it's genetic. I've crashed into withdrawal after binges of massive doses of Klonopin and never got a seizure. I know my threshold is very high, it would take a lot for me to go over that line. Some drugs like Wellbutrin lower the threshold, I'm sure there are more. Yeah, they can stop you from having more, but a really strong one can cause brain damage, you can't fix that. A patient with anxeity and back pain in the ER are automatically suspected of being drug seeking. They're invisible symptoms. Now, psychiatrist hand them out like they are candy. Getting the dose raised is child's play. I once told my current doc that I ordered Valium over the internet, ran out, and was feeling incredibly anxious now. He called in a valium prescription to my pharmacy, no questions asked. He just said, "you need some Valium for that." He costs $135 a month, the initial consult was more expensive though. So I get 60 10mg's a month for $12. Now these are hard to find, but there are sliding scale docs that charge you by your income. Good thing to google for.

 

[Guest]

Ohh, I refuse to take SSRIs, I've been on damn near every one of them at one point or another and they've all made me violently ill. Paxil gave me suicidal ideation. Funny thing is, I told the doctor that I had been on Lexapro before (which was true) and it had made me ill, but I think that nowadays psychiatrists are required by our Lord Gods the pharmaceutical companies to prescribe them no matter the circumstances.

Psychiatrists have done more damage to me than anything else, that is a fact.