Benzo Addiction?

[PTFC]

You should taper or it's a dangerous situation.  I can taper and while I taper, I take melatonin.  Up to 10 mg per night of melatonin is okay.  I read a medical paper on it once and this is what the conclusion was.  As you taper the benzo, up the melatonin.   The worst part for CT on benzo is the not sleeping.  I've done it a few times and was hell.

This is interesting, I had forgotten about this, could you say what you started with dosage wise with the melatonin? 

 

[Andy Monroe]

It's very tough, it's taken me nearly 2 years to taper off down to mg of Di@z. It was just the right time, and I had the right frame of mind to do it though.

This is one of the keys to success, imo, with any med taper: "It was just the right time, and I had the right frame of mind to do it though."

 

[Handsley]

@PTFC.  I would start at a 3mg melatonin.  I recommend the Source Naturals brand.  They are little lozenges you put under your tongue and let it dissolve.  Keep in mind that in order for the melatonin to be activated, you need to have conditions for sleep, which is a dark, quiet room.  Don't expect it to knock you out while you're watching TV or listening to music.  That's not how the hormone works.  My last taper worked at 2 mg xanax + 3X3mg melatonin and I have stopped there for now.  I'm not ready to go all the way down so I'm not an expert with experience, but that's the plan for now.  

 

[troppyfoto]

What symptoms do people have from benzos? has anyone had gut issues from longterm benzo use?

 

[Handsley]

Only pretty damn angry coming off of them, like smash the walls in the house angry.

 

[Kalsima]

I have been clean for almost a year off of hard drugs but Xanax is so hard off to get of . I think it's my clutch for not using other drugs, ie heroin and cocaine but it keeps me clean and I haven't murdered my son yet, he moved back in with me two days ago and I already want to kill him he is driving me crazy already. So as the Rolling Stones say doctor please outside the door she took four more, what a drag it is getting old. Or having a 21 year old no it all because he's in college and knows everything I am so stupid. 

 

[Handsley]

@Heavenlee.  Yes, if I can just keep my dosage down, what a drag it is, but it helps me stay clean from everything else, too.  And it helps with the withdrawals so much.   Hey, that show Stranger Things is coming back for Season 2 on Netflix.  My teenage son and I had a great time watching it together and then talking about it.  Maybe you can get in some quality time with him.  I treated my mom horribly so I always compare and say my son doesn't treat me as bad as I did to my mother so I feel like I might be ahead of the game and karma hasn't gotten me with that one.  Good luck!

 

[Kalsima]

@Handsley we love that show they have so many good ones in Netflix but that's our favorite that is a good idea to watch together. I can't wait to see 11 again and the boys and Wynona Ryder glad she's getting work and she is great in it. Thanks for your suggestion, hugs

 

[Handsley]

@heavenlee, I watched the last episode from last season last night and was up till midnight.  I've been working my butt off all week so I didn't have to work this weekend so we could binge watch the whole season.  Sorry, Admin, for hijacking the thread.  if you grew up in the  '70s or '80s, you will love this show.  Doesn't it remind you of our childhood days?  My son says, how do the parents not know all this is happening in their neighborhood and I told him, honey, that's how it was.  You could run around the neighborhood on your bike and no one watched you.  

 

[Andy Monroe]

I take the Schiff 3mg melatonin sold at Costco, red label, 2 tabs 30 minutes before turning in.  Helps me avoid relying entirely on benzos for sleep, although not as sound (REM sleep) as the benzo.

One important (imo) thing to consider, for ADHD folks, clonidine helps address the underlying causes of sleep disorder (e.g. anxiety management).  Takes a week or two to before becoming effective.  Need a script, and my psychiatrist writes that for me.  Other benefits (again, for me), I - for the first time in 50 years - stopped biting my nails.  I've never owned nail clippers until I went on clonidine.  I'm sure other benefits for me that are not as obvious.  Google ADHD and clonidine and sleep.  Don't think of it as sleep aid, but addresses an imbalance - that I think may be common with addiction.

 

[Kalsima]

@Handsley I went on a binge for only 3 episodes but is freaking awesome best show besides Showtime Ray Donovan! Can't agree with you more! I have decided to try to ween off of my xannies does or has anyone tried benzo islands approach and if so did it work? It seems to me that I feel sick taking Valium that it doesn't cross over. Any help would definitely be appreciated! Thanks!

 

[Handsley]

@Heavenlee,  we got up to the last episode, going to finish it up tonight.  We watched the whole thing this weekend and going to watch Season 1 and 2 again when it's done.  You won't be disappointed in the remaining episodes you have left.  The only thing that's worked for me is tapering for the xans, valium, whatever your choice is.  I don't know what benzo island's approach is.  Please enlighten me.  I have heard of tapering down the xanax and then switching to valium because it's longer acting and then tapering off of that.  I cold turkeyed it twice.  I would not recommend it unless you like to punch holes in your walls, but it can be done this way.  You will not be pleasant to live with and angry all the time.  The last time, I tapered and tapered down to about .25 once a day and would only take it when I got that super angry feeling you get when you don't have it.  I started cutting that .25 in half then, same thing, only when I felt like punching a wall, which was just about every day, but I would try to wait till I had that feeling.  I know you know what I'm talking about.  Then I started every other day and upped the melatonin along with it just so I could sleep.  So if you got to Episode 3, you've probably seen 11 have an angry episode.  I know exactly what she feels like because that's how I feel without the xanax now.  I've been tapering it a bit, 3 to 4 mg per day now and would like to be at 2 mg right before bed.  Even now, I don't take it until I start getting that angry feeling and then I know it's time.  I can usually hold out till 5 in the afternoon, sometimes 7.  Start holding out as long as you can.  Try to have an outlet so you don't break the house like I do.  A designated pillow to punch or something like that, or you will have a plan to go for a good walk or listen to heavy metal, whatever helps you get the anger out.  

@Andy Monroe, that clonidine correlation with biting nails is really interesting.  I am familiar with someone with ADHD and I think he is biting his nails again after not taking it.  You can get some for withdrawals.  They say it helps, but did not help me.   However, I did not take it for a couple of weeks like you recommend. Yes, your sleep will not be as good as on benzos, very light sleep, but this is the trade-off if you want to be rid of them.  

 

[RedGypsy]

Has anybody used benzos long term, like on/off for a few years, to the point where 3-4 mg of kpin/xanax barely phases me anymore, but the only WD symptom I have is insomnia - none of the really scary symptoms?

I have panic disorder (developed it after my thyroidectomy due to cancer & the inability to adjust to the replacement hormones) & have been on anywhere from 4-10mg/Xanax for the last 15 years. I take them in proportion to my anxiety level, because I have never really gotten much of a buzz of them (maybe because my use isn't recreational?  If anything, the only thing they have done for me is make me feel normal).

 When it comes to adjusting my dosage, I have always titrated up/down very slowly & never had any issue. If I start to have any WD's (i.e., insomnia) I just slow it down. Right now I'm on 4-6 mg daily and i don't feel a thing from them, but if I don't take them it's panic attacks 24/7.  My advice if you want off, just take it slowly. Good luck sister!

 

[Kalsima]

@RedGypsy that's a trip I had my thyroid removed from thyroid cancer in 1996. I was totally unaware of this huge adams Apple I had until I was visiting my sister. It shows how much my first husband cared about me how do you live with someone and not notice it. I guess it was the high dosage of methadone we were both on. The operation was supposed to be 40 minutes but turned into a 9 hour event because it was wrapped around my vocal cords. My doctor told me that after removing it only 1% of people die from what I had. I get my th3 or 4_test I'm on synthroid for life I take 150 MCU a day. I know it's scary but I am doing fine today. I'm sorry to hear your story about panic attacks. What hormone replacement did they put you on? I hate panic attacks I only have them when I fight with my son. I have no idea how he turned out so different from me. Maybe I'm too laid back but that jerkwood will not leave me alone until we have "Resolution" that's his big thing right now when I would rather calm down and talk later he demands it right when I want to kill him and won't leave me alone. Thank God I'm leaving Denver December 1st for winter vacation for four months. It's funny everyone thinks it is so cool to live here it is beautiful looking at the snow capped Rockies but I like Florida so much better. And the rec an med weed shops were great but as soon as I got my medical license I quit smoking weed it started making me paranoid. But the prices are so cheap it's crazy.  My husbands dispensary Green Solutions is great but he says there is a difference between their flowers and @bwillia1. Something about the Emerald Triangle he says hers still taste better even though he has found a few exceptions.

So I will be totally honest I take 6 to 8 bars a day. I also know it's a crutch for me I've been clean off hard drugs h and c for a year December 22 I am pretty sure. My son and husband put me on a plane to Florida in the middle of nowhere and I managed to get clean and healthy for the five months I was there. They say it could have been December 31 so I'm not really clear about my sobriety date because I was really bad off. And I know people at AA would say I'm not clean because of the Xanax but I know it helps me stay off hard drugs so screw them. It's better than the alternative! 

So when I leave in a month I'm really going to honestly taper off them. Or at least get down to a reasonable amount. I totally understand taking them for panic attacks even though my tolerance is high it keeps me from killing my son. @Handsley you are awesome that was a great idea. But don't suggest us watching Ru Paul's Drag Race together! 

It's so funny him and his roommate think I don't know they have people over every night. There's a fire escape in the basement and it dings every time it opens. I give them their privacy because they are adults and don't go down to the basement I just called him and he said he was sleeping while I'm sitting in my living room hearing them party through the vents. God was I that stupid when I was a teenager with my parents? Good luck to you all I share all of your pain. Hugs, Heaveblee

 

[Handsley]

@heavenlee,  we will be here for you when you want to taper.  And maybe I'll need to as well by the time you go to Florida.  It's so true that once you have an addict's mind, it doesn't ever really go away.  I can beat it back once in a while, but it's always there.  Ha, we are watching the last episode of Stranger Things 2 tonight on Halloween with burgers and chips.  I can't wait.  

 

[PTFC]

Only pretty damn angry coming off of them, like smash the walls in the house angry.

I hear that @Handsley! Though I've learned to relax a little, lying down doing some breathing exercises or light meditation. I don't have much of a temper at all, but the feeling when dropping a dose on a taper can be rather trying!

I have been clean for almost a year off of hard drugs but Xanax is so hard off to get of . I think it's my clutch for not using other drugs, ie heroin and cocaine but it keeps me clean and I haven't murdered my son yet, he moved back in with me two days ago and I already want to kill him he is driving me crazy already. So as the Rolling Stones say doctor please outside the door she took four more, what a drag it is getting old. Or having a 21 year old no it all because he's in college and knows everything I am so stupid. 

Hahahahaha, of course he knows best @Heavenlee, when you're young you think your parents are completely out of touch and you think you invented sex, never mind that university/college gives some young people a superiority complex!!!

 

[Meowtown]

I just wanted to say anyone who wants to chat about their benzo worries can message me. I have unfortunately been addicted to alprazolam and etizolam and went through hell getting off them both. Multiple grand mal seizures. I was prescribed 2mg bars 4x a day from doctor for three years until he got the DEA book thrown at him then had to cut me off cold Turkey.

Worst time of my life....don't know why I wanted to go through it again with the etiz.

 

[RedGypsy]

@Heavenlee -- What a trip!  I could swear you're my doppelgänger, or maybe I'm yours LOL! I have only known one other person, personally, that has had thyca.  Mine was also a particularly nasty case, although not anything like yours as far as the surgery goes.  Did you end up having any vocal cord damage? Luckily I haven't, my voice is still the same when I speak, although I used to have a decent singing voice, now I can't carry a tune in a wheelbarrow. 

Mine was papillary with a follicular presentation and I diffuse sclerotic variant. I was stage III, because it had spread to my lymph nodes on both sides of my neck, and the lymphs in my arm pit on my left side. So I had a radical neck dissection on both sides as well as the thyroidectomy. It left me with a massive nerve damage on the left side of my neck arm and shoulder, and upper back.  I have been on virtually every thyroid hormone replacement out there, and couldn't tolerate any of them. I ended up on 60 mg of armor, and 75 mcg of Levoxyl, and to be honest it has completely obliterated my life. I have never been able to tolerate TSH suppression, because of the panic attacks/anxiety so mine has come back 3x since 2003. Although I am in remission right now, my diagnosis is currently persistent, meaning they know that it will come back again, it's just a matter of when. If it weren't for the fact I have a 10 yr. old daughter, at this point I just really don't care anymore.

I am sorry to hear that you have such a difficult relationship with your son. Maybe your upcoming Florida will help things chill out. Totally jealous of you by the way. WA. winters are hard, but I know CO  are pretty harsh too. I used to live in Utah (obviously not a Mormon LOL!) so I spent quite a bit of time there. 

I'm lucky, my shrink doesn't care how much Xanax I take. He asks me how much I'm taking at any given time & just writes me a script for that amount. I had hoped it was something I was just going to need until I got stabilized on my thyroid Rx, but that never happened so here I am all these years later Ugh!  Congrats again on your sobriety off H&C. Can't even begin to comprehend how difficult that must be, but I agree if the Xanny's help you screw 'em!... Well, here's to being sisters of misery <clink>!

~RG

 

[Kalsima]

@RedGypsy omg I had nothing like you had! I was diagnosed at stage I and it was only my thyroid that was removed. Now the surgery sucked I just had my son I think he wants to be a girl I swear he's really been letting his gay flag show and he dresses very feminine. Anyway did they keep you in the hospital for three days it sounds like yours was way heavier than mine! They gave me that radiation pellet and I couldn't have any visitors for 3 days and the doctors and nurses wore radiation suits. And when you had to pee or poop they had a screen so they could collect everything going outside my body. So embarrassing! No visitors it was so boring. But I do know what you mean about hormone replacement pills. I only take the levoxyl or synthroid but my husband can tell if I quit taking them which I've done on a few occasions. First he bitches about my hair clogging the shower drain. Because I start losing my hair and I become very depressed it takes me to dark places. He  yells at me that I have no problems taking my xanax everyday but I forget to take my synthroid. I'm one of those people who makes sure I take mind altering pills but think of the pills I know I need to take last! I'm so sorry to hear about your ordeal it sounds like a nightmare no wonder you have anxiety! I never honestly knew how serious thyroid cancer was and worrying at such a stage 3 it could and will be back. I had my ENT doctor remove my thyroid and he acted like it was no big deal. He really said to me you have a 1% chance of dying from Thyroid Cancer. It's the time of the year I just got a script to get my blood levels check and I've had it for a week now I know I should take it more seriously! And yes I can speak normally now. You can barely see my scar it's only 2 inches. I can't believe your ordeal. I had no idea how serious it is. No wander you have anxiety. Your thyroid is so important for making hormones and I don't think a lot of people know that. My shrink knows I take xanax and doesn't seem to care but he won't prescribe them to me. Jerkwood!. I'm so glad you educated me on thyroid cancer because I didn't know how serious it could have been and how lucky and grateful I should be that my experience was totally different than yours. You're a fighter and a survivor but now I realize why you have so much anxiety! I am not religious but I am a Buddhist I go to classes at a Zen temple I'm a beginner nowhere near reaching Nirvana but I do practice is 5 principles and believe in Karma. I will always keep you in my mind and heart when I attend Zen Temple and pray for you. I just started when I got clean and I'm not into organized religion so I'm like  the newbie there. My heart goes out to you but I see so much of you in me you have spunk and you're a fighter I pray that your hormone replacement works for you. It took a few years to get me at the right dosage and I hope only and pray for the best for you. Believe me I totally understand your benzo addiction now and thank you again for educating me. I feel blessed and grateful that I didn't have anything like what you went through. God I was so stupid! Love ya, me

 

[glasscandlegrenades]

@RedGypsy I had papillary Follicular cancer in 2008 I had some minor adjustments from a full thyroidectomy. I have been on benzos b4 and after on and off. I always assumed my anxiety was from having an offset in my endocrine system. I am off all Benzos and only deal with the anxiety using propranolol. Look into this option. It works wonders.